Scripture has the answer ;]
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
You have not confused me gramps, Thanks for your reply.
I do understand that the bible and such book require a bit of studying to understand absolutely everything that is being said. But i don't believe you have to have the "key of david"....ie some divine understanding that few attain to understand what it is saying. Someone that completely disagrees with everything the bible says, could study it and understand it just as well as a die hard believer.
I was not looking for an arguement in this thread, just stating my opinion in response to vagrants opinion. That the bible doesn't have all the answers.
I do understand that the bible and such book require a bit of studying to understand absolutely everything that is being said. But i don't believe you have to have the "key of david"....ie some divine understanding that few attain to understand what it is saying. Someone that completely disagrees with everything the bible says, could study it and understand it just as well as a die hard believer.
I was not looking for an arguement in this thread, just stating my opinion in response to vagrants opinion. That the bible doesn't have all the answers.
Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
I can't speak for vagrant but I believe his comment was not to be taken literal.
At least it's how I took it.
At least it's how I took it.
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
If that was the case, and it was meant as sarcasm, then i do apologize for even comenting.
The reason i thought he really meant that is because there are some people that really DO believe the bible has ALL the answers no matter the question. So i was just stating my counter opinion to that view
The reason i thought he really meant that is because there are some people that really DO believe the bible has ALL the answers no matter the question. So i was just stating my counter opinion to that view
- Bonzo
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Mr. Adamley,Chrisadamley wrote:Hmmm, ok BonzBonzo wrote:Mr. Adamley,
Your confusion of the scriptures is quite normal with one who has self doubt. Once you have obtained the Key of David, the scriptures flow with understanding, the mystery is unlocked, and the true link between the books of the Bible become more clear. It's hard for some to achieve it, in fact, most Christians don't, even preachers. Confused? Open your mind, meditate on it, then ask God.
http://www.thekeyofdavid.org/
Best regards,
Bonz
I am not interpreting anything. I layed down a few quotes out of the bible as they are.
I also don't have self doubt ....
Bonz, just because a person doesn't blindly follow the word of the bible without question, doesn't mean they are unsecure or have self doubt. It fact it probably means the opposite. It means they are secure enough to question it, and bring up points in the bible that make completely no sense, or are horrific by human standards.
There are many, many, MANY points in the bible that directly contradict itself. In fact i would venture a guess that the bible is one of the most inconsistent books out there.
Comments like the one you just posted is the explanation given as to why the bible contradicts itself....."people just don't understand it". It's a book like any other, you don't need some devine understanding to know what its saying.
I never mentioned insecurity, so you brought that one up. It did seem by your posts you were confused, and with your regards to scripture, you obviously have self doubt as to the devinity of the Author. I'd like to see some of the areas where it contradicts itself, but I usually find contradiction and quoting out of context go hand in hand. Yes, to you and countless others, the Bible is just a book, mainly because they don't want to understand it, or they have some other self righteous solution for life. For those who study it, believe in it and the diety of Christ, God grants them a DEVINE understanding, a gift. Just because you don't believe in it, does ot mean its not true. Please don't take it offensively, there's room for good discussion.
Best regards,
Bonz
"A little rebellion now & then is a good thing"
Thomas Jefferson
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
No offense taken bonz! I also welcome a good discussion.
I thought you meant insecurity when you said self doubt. What exactly is your definition of self doubt may i ask?
I am very sure in my opinions.
I choose not to believe something, until strong evidence is shown supporting it.
What is the sense believing in something in which no evidence exists? Its like, just blindly believing with no foundation. I believe in the scientific method Also, just a note, the bible isn't evidence for God.
...............
Also, i will find some contradictions and get them together, i haved a few off the top of my head, but will get a couple more. So we can discuss them.
Thanks.
I thought you meant insecurity when you said self doubt. What exactly is your definition of self doubt may i ask?
I am very sure in my opinions.
I choose not to believe something, until strong evidence is shown supporting it.
What is the sense believing in something in which no evidence exists? Its like, just blindly believing with no foundation. I believe in the scientific method Also, just a note, the bible isn't evidence for God.
...............
Also, i will find some contradictions and get them together, i haved a few off the top of my head, but will get a couple more. So we can discuss them.
Thanks.
Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Sorry Chrisaadamley, but the Bible has no contradictions!
This is something I found that can explain what I said much better than I.
Many Biblical critics do not reference the original Hebrew and Greek texts when
searching for errors. In my opinion, this is poor, irresponsible scholarship. Such critics fail to realize translation difficulties are not exclusive to the Bible. Any text
translated into another language will contain errors due to the
use idioms, archaic terminology, and puns that do not translate properly into other languages. In order to finally
resolve such errors, links will be provided to the original Hebrew/Greek throughout this article. Using this method, we will find most alleged contradictions do not even exist.
Chrisaadamley please think about this first, when you talk about how the Bible contradicts itself.
This is a very good link to Bible contradictions and how they can be explained away.
Please find your answers here, http://atheismexposed.tripod.com/bible_ ... ctions.htm before you post them on the forum. I'm sure you will be enlightened. At least I hope so...Enjoy! Here is another site http://usminc.org/contradictions.html
The reason for the edit was to list another Website.
This is something I found that can explain what I said much better than I.
Many Biblical critics do not reference the original Hebrew and Greek texts when
searching for errors. In my opinion, this is poor, irresponsible scholarship. Such critics fail to realize translation difficulties are not exclusive to the Bible. Any text
translated into another language will contain errors due to the
use idioms, archaic terminology, and puns that do not translate properly into other languages. In order to finally
resolve such errors, links will be provided to the original Hebrew/Greek throughout this article. Using this method, we will find most alleged contradictions do not even exist.
Chrisaadamley please think about this first, when you talk about how the Bible contradicts itself.
This is a very good link to Bible contradictions and how they can be explained away.
Please find your answers here, http://atheismexposed.tripod.com/bible_ ... ctions.htm before you post them on the forum. I'm sure you will be enlightened. At least I hope so...Enjoy! Here is another site http://usminc.org/contradictions.html
The reason for the edit was to list another Website.
If I only knew!
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
The prohibition of eating pigs was replaced by one against dating pigs? Just KIDDING! Actually I think Gramps makes a good point..
Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Gramps, thank you for posting those links, and for your very kind and very detailed information.
I am a Christian, I believe in God, Christ, heaven and hell. I believe the Bible, although I do consider the fact that this was written in a very old language, and written by men who were witnesses things or were inspired by God to write these events down.
This tells me we have to accept the fact that every author has a little different writing style, different interpretation, and that the Bible is full of symbolism, like the verse about plucking out your eye. If I remember correctly, it was an analogy, "if thine eye offends thee, pluck it out, if thine hand offends thee cut it off..." I always took that as an analogy not to be carried out literally.
I have also been learning more about the Roman Empire and it's relationship with the Catholic Church. What I have read says the King took the Bible and picked out and added things to suit his needs.
This is probably where some of the carnage, torture and 'smiting' came into print.
I think the basic Christian message taught by Christ himself still remains the same, and even to people who are not believers, they would find that if they followed those basic principals, they would live a happier more prosperous life. It's mainly about doing the right thing, and feeling good about it. Loving each other, being a good example...
I have had some unexplainable events throughout my life that I could ONLY attribute to divine intervention. They were real miracles, so I myself have NO DOUBT at all that God is good and that God is real.
In fact, I think it takes a further stretch to NOT believe than to believe.
I don't attend a church on a regular basis. I enjoy watching Joel Osteen and Joyce meyers, and I worship God in my own private way. Joel Osteen especially always has a positive uplifting message. he likes to encourage people and to remind them how much God loves them. It's never fire and brimstone style teaching from him. They call him the Smiling Preacher.
I love the fact you guys are so respectful towards each other.
That is one thing that makes this forum like no other forum I have ever seen. Everyone is genuinely nice here.
Jody
I am a Christian, I believe in God, Christ, heaven and hell. I believe the Bible, although I do consider the fact that this was written in a very old language, and written by men who were witnesses things or were inspired by God to write these events down.
This tells me we have to accept the fact that every author has a little different writing style, different interpretation, and that the Bible is full of symbolism, like the verse about plucking out your eye. If I remember correctly, it was an analogy, "if thine eye offends thee, pluck it out, if thine hand offends thee cut it off..." I always took that as an analogy not to be carried out literally.
I have also been learning more about the Roman Empire and it's relationship with the Catholic Church. What I have read says the King took the Bible and picked out and added things to suit his needs.
This is probably where some of the carnage, torture and 'smiting' came into print.
I think the basic Christian message taught by Christ himself still remains the same, and even to people who are not believers, they would find that if they followed those basic principals, they would live a happier more prosperous life. It's mainly about doing the right thing, and feeling good about it. Loving each other, being a good example...
I have had some unexplainable events throughout my life that I could ONLY attribute to divine intervention. They were real miracles, so I myself have NO DOUBT at all that God is good and that God is real.
In fact, I think it takes a further stretch to NOT believe than to believe.
I don't attend a church on a regular basis. I enjoy watching Joel Osteen and Joyce meyers, and I worship God in my own private way. Joel Osteen especially always has a positive uplifting message. he likes to encourage people and to remind them how much God loves them. It's never fire and brimstone style teaching from him. They call him the Smiling Preacher.
I love the fact you guys are so respectful towards each other.
That is one thing that makes this forum like no other forum I have ever seen. Everyone is genuinely nice here.
Jody
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Hey Jody, thanks for jumping in with your opinion.
Could i ask what life events you have experienced that you can only 100% contribute to god?
Thanks.
Could i ask what life events you have experienced that you can only 100% contribute to god?
Thanks.
Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Hi Chris, I would be glad to share a few of these events with you. I don't share this with just everyone because I know there are a lot of people who, no matter what I say, will not believe me, and I'm not doing this to convince anyone, but rather just share something miraculous that happened.
About 10 yrs ago, my daughter Mary was only 5 yrs old. She stepped off a curb in front of an oncoming car. It was a mid sized car and the driver himself claims he was doing about 40mph
The car knocked her into the air and made her shoes fly off! She landed on the road, and then JUMPED to her feet and ran out of the road, and into the house. The Driver was so shaken that he had to have his wife come get him and their car.
I checked my daughter from head to toe, even took her to a chiropractor for a full body /spine Xray
Can you believe that kid did not have so much as a red mark or a bruise? No broken bones, no concussions, no stitches. The Dr weighed her that day and she was a full 45 lbs, lol
a 45 lb little girl vs a Ford taurus
The Drivers Wife explained to us that just 1 year before this happened, THEY had a little 3 yr old girl who was accidently killed by her son in their driveway.
The kid was backing out and the little girl was sitting behind his tire.
The Father had such a hard time forgiving his step son, and after this happened to Mary, his heart changed about that. He knew how terrible it felt to be the Driver, and how sorry someone is after something happens by accident.
The neighbor guy was bout 75 yrs old. He witnessed Mary get hit and said he ran for a blanket to cover up "the body"
He could not get over the fact she was not only okay, but totally FINE
He told me he witnessed a little girl (when he was a kid ) who stepped off the very same curb and was hit and died.
He came down to my house a few days later to see mary again with his own eyes and told me he had nightmares after seeing her hit.
Out of the mouths of babes, little Mary told me when the car hit her, she "felt like Bumpa (my dad who passed away) or God or somebody LIFTED her up into the air and the car went under her....
Now mind you, we were not regular church goers, we didn't really practice anything at home, she came out with this on her own.
My hair stands on end any time I have told this story. I have had other 'weird' things happen that were more obviously 'divine intervention', but when this happened to mary, I cried all weekend knowing that I could have been making funeral arrangements for my littlest girl.
In my heart I feel like God 'borrowed' mary to help this man (Driver)
That day changed his life, and changed mine too.
I will post another post and tell you some other things that happened. I am sure you too have had miracles in your life that maybe you did not recognize them for what they were.
Jody
About 10 yrs ago, my daughter Mary was only 5 yrs old. She stepped off a curb in front of an oncoming car. It was a mid sized car and the driver himself claims he was doing about 40mph
The car knocked her into the air and made her shoes fly off! She landed on the road, and then JUMPED to her feet and ran out of the road, and into the house. The Driver was so shaken that he had to have his wife come get him and their car.
I checked my daughter from head to toe, even took her to a chiropractor for a full body /spine Xray
Can you believe that kid did not have so much as a red mark or a bruise? No broken bones, no concussions, no stitches. The Dr weighed her that day and she was a full 45 lbs, lol
a 45 lb little girl vs a Ford taurus
The Drivers Wife explained to us that just 1 year before this happened, THEY had a little 3 yr old girl who was accidently killed by her son in their driveway.
The kid was backing out and the little girl was sitting behind his tire.
The Father had such a hard time forgiving his step son, and after this happened to Mary, his heart changed about that. He knew how terrible it felt to be the Driver, and how sorry someone is after something happens by accident.
The neighbor guy was bout 75 yrs old. He witnessed Mary get hit and said he ran for a blanket to cover up "the body"
He could not get over the fact she was not only okay, but totally FINE
He told me he witnessed a little girl (when he was a kid ) who stepped off the very same curb and was hit and died.
He came down to my house a few days later to see mary again with his own eyes and told me he had nightmares after seeing her hit.
Out of the mouths of babes, little Mary told me when the car hit her, she "felt like Bumpa (my dad who passed away) or God or somebody LIFTED her up into the air and the car went under her....
Now mind you, we were not regular church goers, we didn't really practice anything at home, she came out with this on her own.
My hair stands on end any time I have told this story. I have had other 'weird' things happen that were more obviously 'divine intervention', but when this happened to mary, I cried all weekend knowing that I could have been making funeral arrangements for my littlest girl.
In my heart I feel like God 'borrowed' mary to help this man (Driver)
That day changed his life, and changed mine too.
I will post another post and tell you some other things that happened. I am sure you too have had miracles in your life that maybe you did not recognize them for what they were.
Jody
Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Chris back in the late 80's I was married to a soldier in the Army and we lived in W Germany. We were planning on going to the Ramstein Airshow and see the Blue Angels flying.Chrisadamley wrote:Hey Jody, thanks for jumping in with your opinion.
Could i ask what life events you have experienced that you can only 100% contribute to god?
Thanks.
When we went to leave, our car WOULD NOT start.
My husband checked everything he could think of. There was nothing he could find that should prevent the car from starting.
We came back int he house with our kids very disappointed. About an hour and a half later, we get a call from my husbands Unit, asking if we had attended the event. It was at that moment we were told about the Ramstein Airshow Disaster, in which a plane crashed into the crowd, killing and injuring a BUNCH of people.
My husband was ordered to get to the Post and get on a bus to go give blood. He went back out to the car to try once again to figure out what was wrong, and it STARTED right up! The car was fine
I believe God prevented us from going. The people who were hurt, were the ones like us, in the front with the small children.
There was no other explanation. The only thing that had changed was that it was too late for us to go to the airshow.
And then the car started.
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
If you are not particularly religious, no more so the the average person...Then why do you believe god is watching out for you and sparing "your" life but not all those other people?
I do not believe any miracles happened in my life...I can not think of one such amazing story. When my parents were hit by that truck they both died.
I do not believe any miracles happened in my life...I can not think of one such amazing story. When my parents were hit by that truck they both died.
- Vagrant
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Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Miracles, by their very rarity, are an EXTREME departure, from the usual course of events
No matter what you attribute them to, [devine intervention or luck] they represent an occurance that runs counter to hundreds of thousands of the usual results.
If they "happened all the time", there would be nothing miraculous about them
No matter what you attribute them to, [devine intervention or luck] they represent an occurance that runs counter to hundreds of thousands of the usual results.
If they "happened all the time", there would be nothing miraculous about them
Re: Scripture has the answer ;]
Chrisaadamley, Not all of us have miraculous stories like Jody's.
Just the fact that God made each one of us and has given us a chance to search for and find him is a miracle and proof of his love. Along the way in life, so much of what happens to us and to others...the terrible pains are opportunities for us to get angry with God and wonder if He's abandoned us or just doesn't really care. Human nature always wants to figure out why He does things and if He's playing fair. I think we have to relinquish that and just acknowledge that He is God and trust Him even though we don't understand.
He is the potter and we are the clay. As He says in Isaiah:
“For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways My ways,” says the LORD.
“ For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are My ways higher than your ways,
And My thoughts than your thoughts."
In another place in the Bible, He says, "Without faith, it is impossible to please God."
The bottom line is that we're on earth to find Him. We can pursue Him or remain indifferent. He's a gentleman and won't force Himself upon us. But if we take a step toward Him, He will always rush to meet us. When we give our life to Him, he gives us back so much more. Peace, forgiveness, joy through life's pain and the promise of heaven when this life is over.
Just the fact that God made each one of us and has given us a chance to search for and find him is a miracle and proof of his love. Along the way in life, so much of what happens to us and to others...the terrible pains are opportunities for us to get angry with God and wonder if He's abandoned us or just doesn't really care. Human nature always wants to figure out why He does things and if He's playing fair. I think we have to relinquish that and just acknowledge that He is God and trust Him even though we don't understand.
He is the potter and we are the clay. As He says in Isaiah:
“For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways My ways,” says the LORD.
“ For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are My ways higher than your ways,
And My thoughts than your thoughts."
In another place in the Bible, He says, "Without faith, it is impossible to please God."
The bottom line is that we're on earth to find Him. We can pursue Him or remain indifferent. He's a gentleman and won't force Himself upon us. But if we take a step toward Him, He will always rush to meet us. When we give our life to Him, he gives us back so much more. Peace, forgiveness, joy through life's pain and the promise of heaven when this life is over.
If I only knew!