Frank Bertrame Steel

vetkaw63 · Post by **vetkaw63** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 8:17 pm

FB website says they use W.1. 4034 stainless. How does this compare to 420, 420HC, 440C?
Thanks Guys,
Mike

Trey45 · Post by **Trey45** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:08 pm

From a machinists point of view, 4034 is much harder to machine than 440 , both require massive coolant and relatively slow cutting feed and speed, the problem with 4034 is tool chatter and wearout using inserts and carbide.This leads me to believe it's a REALLY hard stainless, more resistant to knicks and scratching. As far as the rockwell hardness I don't know and my handbook is in my toolbox

Wolverton · Post by **Wolverton** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:55 am

Its similar in hardness to Case knives etc. Not really great, but not bad either.

Vagrant · Post by **Vagrant** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 3:19 am

Both have .4% - .5% carbon and 4034 can have .5% more crome [but doesn't necessarily have it]. Trace elements in 4034 should make it slightly more machinable [but "should" and "does" are seldom the same thing]

vetkaw63 · Post by **vetkaw63** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 6:54 am

Thanks for all the replies. I really want to know if you guys think that it is a quality steel? I have always shied away from Italians because of the cheap imitations that I had as a teenager. I have some German made knives and a Mikov, but they advertised them as 420. I have recently bought an AKC leverletto that Bill DeShivs helped design, that has 440C.
FORTUNE SALES has some AWESOME pricing on AKC's and Bertrames. I would like to buy one of each. I really carry and use my knives so I want a steel that is actually used to cut not just stab. What do you guys think of Bertrames (flat grind) and FORTUNE SALES?
Mike

Big Daddy · Post by **Big Daddy** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 7:00 am

Stu at Fortune sales is great! he has a number of stuff at bladebid too! he is tops in my book as well as many here

Post by **Bill DeShivs** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 8:00 am

Hi, Mike.
It's Beltrame, not Bertrame.
I didn't help design the Leverletto. I designed it.
If you want a stiletto that cuts, AB (SKM) offers an ATS 34 blade.

Bill

vetkaw63 · Post by **vetkaw63** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 8:29 am

Bill,
Thanks for clarifying that for me. The only reason that I tried an Italian was because your name was on it. Now I want more!
Mike

Vagrant · Post by **Vagrant** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 7:59 pm

Bill DeShivs wrote:Hi, Mike.
It's Beltrame, not Bertrame.
I didn't help design the Leverletto. I designed it.
If you want a stiletto that cuts, AB (SKM) offers an ATS 34 blade.

Bill

ATS-34 stainless is about as good as it gets [for stainless

]. It sharpens fairly easily and holds an edge pretty well.
The Damascus blades defy logic, they are mede from two kinds of stainless [allegedly] and have a low Rockwell hardness level. Despite this the sharpen more like carbon steel and have similar edge holding properties. Subjected to adverse conditions they will stain, [again, like carbon steel]. My favorite Stiletto is a Briarwood, flat-grind, Damascus that has been used heavily

Wolverton · Post by **Wolverton** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 11:32 pm

Wow, learn somthin new everyday. I had always assumed that Damascus was carbon steel.

Vagrant · Post by **Vagrant** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 5:36 pm

Wolverton wrote:Wow, learn somthin new everyday. I had always assumed that Damascus was carbon steel.

I have been told [by several sources] it is "Damasteel" [ http://www.damasteel.biz/ ] but it behaves very much like carbon steel Damascus, possibly TWO sources and two different types have been used

The low hardness rating of the Damascus [55 Rockwell] vs 58 -59 for the 420 stainless, defies logic

It holds an edge better, cuts better, and sharpens easier just like carbon steel. [Damascus can give widely differing readings readings depending or where you test it

]

Grim · Post by **Grim** » Mon Jan 30, 2006 3:41 pm

on my opinion stilettos are not really good work knives but tinys also has ats-34 steel blade stilettos

vetkaw63 · Post by **vetkaw63** » Mon Jan 30, 2006 4:18 pm

Hi,
I don't want anybody getting the wrong idea. The most that my carry knives get is to cut an apple or carrots for lunch at work. You would be surprised at how fast that will dull a blade. I NEVER pry with my knives.
Mike