can we talk akc knives, please.

[snakebit]

guys, i'm new here and very inexperienced with the switchblade knife. this is my first real post and trying to research my question(s) led me to the forum here. i've picked up some info but not quite sure i'm digesting as so to understand it properly. my issue is with an akc swinguard knife i just purchased about 9 days ago. i thought i purchased an "akc italy" knife, but when it arrived it said "akc world". i have been doing some reading here and found out the "world" knives are the akc brand that's made in china. whaaat? no more made in italy knives?

so in a thread here under switchblades, someone was asking pretty much what i was wondering about. there was even a link to a youtube vid explaining the differences between what looked like exactly my "world" knife and a "made in italy" knife. the knife the guy on the vid called a counterfeit or copy had all the call outs of a fake akc. spring size, blade differences, swinguards that rattled and the whole knife was a bit bigger, etc. and of course no "italy" mark on the blade.

i wrote an email to the store online i got it from. i explained how i believed it to be a fake and and i asked about the "world" marking cause in their on-line description, they clearly said the blade was marked "akc italy".
i said i'd be willing to exchange it for a real akc marked italy or i wanted a refund. that's where i am now, there's a postage label in my mail box. they are taking it back. below is what they told me after i questioned them on my initial contact.

" Thanks for reaching out to us about the AKC Swinguard.

Some of the AKC models are listed as made in "Italy" others may have "AKC World" depending on the manufacturer's choice of origin even though originally they were listed as made in Italy.

We no longer have any of these in stock.

We have a 90-day return policy if you would like to initiate a return for a full refund. I will be happy to set that up for you! We do not offer exchanges or replacements, however, you would receive a refund once the return is received and processed. Please let me know if you would like that set up."

i'm sorry this is so long...the knife i have is very nice, simulated ivory handle, 10" oal. i do like it but really don't want a chinese knife. on the other hand, it's a beautiful knife.

so after all this, i'm still not sure what i have really. looking for guidance and help on this subject. it may have been beat to death, these "world" marked knives but i was hoping we could revisit the subject.

and the vendor has been mentioned on this subject in the thread i was referring to at the beginning of my post here. don't see the need to beat them up. thanks for hanging with me if you made it to the end of this post.

[Bill DeShivs]

What you have is a Chinese knife.
How it's marked doesn't matter.

[john]

I would return that fake for a refund.
If you want a genuine Italian knife check this site out.
https://www.knifeshop.com/en/product/19 ... d-iiv.html
I didn’t see any swinguards for sale, but if you’re looking for the classic Italian stiletto I did see Frank Beltrame knives on the site.
And here’s an auction site https://www.sharperdeals.net/
Welcome to the forum,
John

[Killgar]

The way I see it, when it comes to Italian versus Chinese, the big questions are-

1. Does it matter to you where the knife comes from?

2. Does fake, or possible fake branding matter to you?

3. Are the prices US vendors sell the Chinese knives for excessively high?

As far as quality, although I'm generally not a fan of Chinese switchblades, they can be of decent quality. In fact, they can be of higher quality than some Italian knives.

Another issue however is price. A Chinese switchblade of decent quality for say, $25, is not a ridiculous price. But paying $100 or more for a Chinese switchblade is way too much in my opinion. Often the mark-up is done by US vendors, whereas the actual Chinese sell them for around $25, or less.

You could search for and buy a genuine Italian switchblade/swing guard, but you might be surprised at the shoddy quality that many Italian switchblades suffer from. Genuine Italian only means "made in Italy", it doesn't necessarily mean "quality". And I say that as someone who has now purchased 15 Italian switchblades (13 Frank Beltrame, 2 AGA Campolin).

If you like the knife, if it's of decent quality, and if you didn't pay much for it, I'd say you might as well keep it. If you don't like it, if you over-paid for it, if it's a piece of junk, or if you're just opposed to owning a Chinese-made switchblade, then I'd say return it.

If you're looking for a guaranteed GENUINE Italian swing guard stiletto switchblade, myswitchblade.com has a customized 11" Frank Beltrame for $266, and Arizona Customs currently has a pre-owned 11" for $260. They're pretty rare right now, and one never knows if Mr. Beltrame will be making any more.

And as far as any new knives being sold with "AKC" on them, I'd wait until there is solid confirmation regarding who exactly is involved in their production and sale before buying any more to avoid the chance of buying a counterfeit. In my opinion, such confirmation does not currently exist.

[snakebit]

what confuses me is i always thought in the united states, there was some trade law that said a consumer product had to be marked with the country of origin, in english, on that product. this says "world", obviously not a country of origin.

also, how easy would it be for the seller to just say clearly that the knife is an akc branded knife made in china, but they don't, they tip toe around not saying exactly where it's made. in my case the vendor said "others may have "AKC World" depending on the manufacturer's choice of origin..." what the heck does that mean? thats double speak for they want the buyer to think it's still an italian knife.

another bothersome area for me is that youtube video that was linked here in switchblades where a guy i don't know was comparing 2 akc knives. one which he said was a real italian made akc, and the other, well...the same knife i own. he calls the knife that's basically the same as mine a fake akc. the vendor i bought it from calls it a real akc made somewhere other than italy.

i paid $99 for this knife. the web page said $199 was normal retail. you know guys, i really don't think it's a badly crafted knife and 99 dollars was fine when i got it in my hand. do i like it? yes, i do. it's a beautiful knife, everything i wanted and frankly more. but my issue is...what do i have exactly with this knife marked "world"? since they won't say once and for all the country of origin, can i assume there are a few manufacturing locations around the world. is akc doing what is the trend in manufacturing, moving off shore to cut costs?

i think what bothers me is i can't get any real answers as to the history of this akc knife. the markings say the knife was not made in italy even though it's being sold in the italian knife category on web vendors pages instead of the italian style category, where i think it belongs. unless it's a real akc knife...just not made in italy. my head is spinning.

[Tom19176]

snakebit, I assume you bought it from Grindworks. I wrote to them months ago and posted it here how they were selling COUNTERFIETS marked AKC. It took several emails form me and others to change the wording of their ad. Now this AKC World comes along. Not sure how real this is, but it seems there MAYBE some arrangement with the real AKC and them.

This is a HONEST dealer that is selling what I think you bought:
https://www.perryknifeworks.com/item--m ... -2-polish/

[sammy the blade]

Been awhile back when china had to mark the knives and the just put a sticker on it that said china. Those were cheap switchblades, i left them on the knives when I sold them but those were in the days where they were hard to find, unless you visited here.

[snakebit]

Now this AKC World comes along. Not sure how real this is, but it seems there MAYBE some arrangement with the real AKC and them.

sounds like if you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

i'm on a mission now to find out what is what with these akc world knives.

i may keep my knife, as i said, it's a beautiful build. i particularly like the sound it makes when the spring resets when you close the blade. like a vault, no less. it hasn't misfired...well, maybe once, but a bit of lube solved that.

i'm going to make some phone calls in the next few days, going to try and get some info. i get obsessed with this small stuff and hang on like a remora. i'm not wound over the quality, just the fact that we can't get information.

thanks to you all. i'll post more if i have anything solid to add here. in the meantime i'll continue to see if anyone adds anything more.

[JulesVane]

The genuine AKC swinguards (now marked A.G.A. Campolin) are/were 9" swinguards. You'll find the Chinese counterfeit's to be 10". I'd avoid any marked AKC, and go for the newer, genuine marked A.G.A. Campolin.

[snakebit]

The genuine AKC swinguards (now marked A.G.A. Campolin) are/were 9" swinguards. You'll find the Chinese counterfeit's to be 10". I'd avoid any marked AKC, and go for the newer, genuine marked A.G.A. Campolin.

if this is common knowledge, the 10" swinguards are chinese counterfeits, and i got mine from a reputable on-line dealer, why doesn't the dealer know this? why do they continue to sell these. my dealer says my 10" akc swinguard they sold me is an akc. where it was made is a gray area. why would this respected dealer be so convinced this 10" is real?

i'm still under the impression no one really knows what's going on with these. but i need a drink! so here's what i know...

- they're fake
- they're akc's but not made in italy
- they're akc's made somewhere in the world
- akc's made in china and sanctioned by akc

now we have a new player

- real akc's are now marked aga, campolin

[john]

Try contacting Angelo Campolin at: info@knifeshop.com
Maybe he can give you the answers/clarification you and all of us could use when buying AKC knives.

[RoyS]

Hi snakebite,

Welcome to the forum.

Some really great and authoritative replies here, so an interesting thread. I'm no expert at all, so feel free to ignore any and all that I say

As such I can't address any of your concerns 'but' if I may share (just for fun). The only AKC I own is branded 'AKC Italy', it's a swing guard, white (plastic) scales and is around 10" overall. Compared to my Latama and Floris knives, it really is quite cheaply made and doesn't hold up in any way.

The irony is I handle it more than any other knife, as I use it as a letter/box opener and it works great for that. It was a gift from a dear friend and rekindled my interest in automatics, so despite it's very poor quality, it still brings me joy.

Not helpful at all - I know- but there you go!

Cheerio,
Roy

[snakebit]

....it really is quite cheaply made and doesn't hold up in any way.

roy, thanks for the welcome.

oddly, i thought my 10" akc was extremely well made when i unboxed it, or rather unbagged it. i was impressed with the fit and finish, way much better than i was expecting. it had some heft, also. the blade snapped to with authority. now, i wasn't expecting this "quality" cause the last swinguard auto i purchased, waaay, waaay back, was horrible. a cheap piece of junk. i think by the third day the guards popped off then soon after, the blade took on some serious wobble. it was the last knife of the type i bought for a very long time...well, until now.

again, my problem is where was it made and why can't a vendor just come on out and say it's chinese if in fact it really is. i'm leaning seriously on keeping it. i'm just pissed cause i feel i was led to believe it was italian made. and you can't get the damn things. i went on a notify list for this one. as soon as i got the email i ordered it. and then less than 24 hours later they're out of stock again. from the intel i got from outside this site, i really feel they are made under license from akc outside italy. the knife is marked "world" cause there are a couple sites of manufacture and the vendor really doesn't know where the latest batch of knives are made.

i'll keep plugging away. i love a good mystery.

[RoyS]

Well done snakebite,

As long as you're happy that's all that matter.

And 'yes' a good mystery is always fun, good luck mate.

Cheerio,
Roy

[Dave. B]

The genuine AKC swinguards (now marked A.G.A. Campolin) are/were 9" swinguards. You'll find the Chinese counterfeit's to be 10". I'd avoid any marked AKC, and go for the newer, genuine marked A.G.A. Campolin.

if this is common knowledge, the 10" swinguards are chinese counterfeits, and i got mine from a reputable on-line dealer, why doesn't the dealer know this? why do they continue to sell these. my dealer says my 10" akc swinguard they sold me is an akc. where it was made is a gray area. why would this respected dealer be so convinced this 10" is real?

i'm still under the impression no one really knows what's going on with these. but i need a drink! so here's what i know...

- they're fake
- they're akc's but not made in italy
- they're akc's made somewhere in the world
- akc's made in china and sanctioned by akc

now we have a new player

- real akc's are now marked aga, campolin

The dealer does know the knife is a fake. They know exactly where the knife was imported from and the wholesaler in China that sold them the knives. The dealer is bullshitting you. DH Gate, Wish, Alibaba, and other wholesalers are knowingly selling counterfeit knives wearing a legitimate company's logo to American knife dealers, who then knowingly sell their counterfeit contraband to unsuspecting people. Your swinguard is not an AKC and AKC has not made swinguard or stiletto knives in quite some time.