Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

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NorthCarolinaDude
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by NorthCarolinaDude »

Killgar wrote: Sun Jun 19, 2022 5:54 am
NorthCarolinaDude wrote: Sun Jun 19, 2022 4:24 am Yes, excellent work indeed, Killgar. I'm not a Ti-Lite guy, I think I have a knockoff here somewhere, but the 3 you have built would certainly change my interests if I could find such a conversion. Honestly, there hasn't been a knife you've done yet that I wouldn't immediately snap up if available!

And it would be nice if we could see more "thicc" built specimens such as your work represented in the stiletto class!

Peace.
I actually plan on selling most of what remains of my "collection", including the top knife pictured below (11" stiletto). That one's the better of the two, with most of the parts made by hand. I'm looking to downsize my "collection". I don't need the money, but I like the idea of my knives being owned and appreciated by others, and I don't have anyone I'd want to leave them to. I plan on keeping the bottom knife, I want to keep at least one 11" stiletto for sentimental reasons.

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Tell you what brother, when you're ready to part with mentioned 11" in the pic, and have a price in mind, be sure to PM me as I'd like an opportunity to consider said purchase. It's unique and I like unique.

Peace. Scott
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Killgar
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by Killgar »

NorthCarolinaDude wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 5:08 am
Killgar wrote: Sun Jun 19, 2022 5:54 am
NorthCarolinaDude wrote: Sun Jun 19, 2022 4:24 am Yes, excellent work indeed, Killgar. I'm not a Ti-Lite guy, I think I have a knockoff here somewhere, but the 3 you have built would certainly change my interests if I could find such a conversion. Honestly, there hasn't been a knife you've done yet that I wouldn't immediately snap up if available!

And it would be nice if we could see more "thicc" built specimens such as your work represented in the stiletto class!

Peace.
I actually plan on selling most of what remains of my "collection", including the top knife pictured below (11" stiletto). That one's the better of the two, with most of the parts made by hand. I'm looking to downsize my "collection". I don't need the money, but I like the idea of my knives being owned and appreciated by others, and I don't have anyone I'd want to leave them to. I plan on keeping the bottom knife, I want to keep at least one 11" stiletto for sentimental reasons.

Image
Tell you what brother, when you're ready to part with mentioned 11" in the pic, and have a price in mind, be sure to PM me as I'd like an opportunity to consider said purchase. It's unique and I like unique.

Peace. Scott
I'll do that. I appreciate your interest. :)
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tr4252
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by tr4252 »

Nice work indeed Mr. Killgar!

We seem to be in agreement about how a knife should be made. Like you, I went all screw construction, adjustable pivot tension, etc. Once, on a whim I made a stilletto with a ball bearing pivot. It's really smooth and snappy, but was a lot of extra work. I also found out that the bearings disintegrate after a few thousand snaps, but I bought plenty of spares (I noted your remark about sources drying up, I've always had the same problem)

Wish you'd been here back then, we could have compared notes.

Funny, but I noticed you also made your knives with different front bolsters. I ended up doing the same; first I was relieving the guard (wings?), and soon found out what a huge pain in the ass fairing in those intersecting radii was, so I began leaving them with a simpler profile (green scaled one at top of group photo was the prototype for this design, a little too labor intensive).

Tom
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by tr4252 »

Welcome to the forum Cop_Out. Hope you enjoy this hobby.

Per Sammy, like a kot of manglers, I got started building after my first stilletto turned out to be a dud. I remember thinking "Hell is this the best they can do?" I was especially disappointed with the scales, they were really thick and ill fitting. Won't name the brand here. After the first 10 knives or so I realized the run of the mill is pretty poor at times. Anyway, I'm a mechanical guy and decided to try fixing it. By the time I got done only the blade and spring remained of the original parts. It was a bit clunky but the guys here were pretty encourageing. Next I started scratch building, first conventional Italianish knives, then the torsion spring type in the group photo.

Higher quality knives like the Leverletto and Godfather have better fit and finish.

As Killgar said, guys who make custom knives are dwindling. I know I dwindled, and don't make knives any more. It seemed once I was building the kind of knives I wanted for myself, I got it out of my system.

Good luck!

Tom
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by sammy the blade »

Tom, I remember when you were doing those. I would have gave a testicle for one of them, maybe both of them.
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Killgar
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by Killgar »

tr4252 wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 10:11 am Nice work indeed Mr. Killgar!

We seem to be in agreement about how a knife should be made. Like you, I went all screw construction, adjustable pivot tension, etc. Once, on a whim I made a stilletto with a ball bearing pivot. It's really smooth and snappy, but was a lot of extra work. I also found out that the bearings disintegrate after a few thousand snaps, but I bought plenty of spares (I noted your remark about sources drying up, I've always had the same problem)

Wish you'd been here back then, we could have compared notes.

Funny, but I noticed you also made your knives with different front bolsters. I ended up doing the same; first I was relieving the guard (wings?), and soon found out what a huge pain in the ass fairing in those intersecting radii was, so I began leaving them with a simpler profile (green scaled one at top of group photo was the prototype for this design, a little too labor intensive).

Tom
Thank you Tom. Coming from a true craftsman like yourself that means a lot. :)

Beautiful work on those knives of yours. I really like the "modern" styling and the heavy-duty look and construction. Every part of those knives just screams "QUALITY".

In regards to my two 11" stilettos, I built the bottom one first (referring to my earlier pic). For that one I used the liners and bolsters from a Rite Edge manual stiletto (stainless steel liners, solid ss bolsters welded onto the liners). The only parts of that knife that I made are the handle scales and the lock-release thumb-press. All the rest of the parts are aftermarket. I did have to do some drilling in the liners, as the Rite Edge was not made for the aftermarket parts I was using. And in order to achieve zero blade or lock play (a mandatory requirement) I had to drill out the pivot hole in the blade, custom fit it to the pivot, as well as custom fit the blade to the lock.

But there were issues with the Rite edge liners/bolsters. The original pivot holes had been drilled at a slight angle. This was an inherent flaw in the Rite Edge stilettos. As a result the blade was canted to one side when open, and it rubbed hard on one of the liners when closed. Even after some careful re-alignment work on the pivot holes, I could not achieve a centered blade. I was able to move the blade over just enough that it no longer rubbed on the liner, but I like a centered blade.

And so, unhappy with the uncentered blade, I decided to build my second 11" from the liners out, so that I could better control the overall quality of the knife. On my second 11" I made the liners, bolsters, and handle scales from scratch, and I designed and fabricated the lock release. The blade, spring/lock, sear/rocker arm and button are all aftermarket. On that knife I was able to achieve a more centered blade, along with all of my other quality demands.

And boy, I know what you mean about "labor intensive". I had considered buying some Frank Beltrame and Latama stilettos and re-building them like the top knife I built, and only using the blades and spring/locks from those knives, but making those guard bolsters is so much work, as well as the lock-release mechanism I designed, that I never did follow through with the idea. Now that I think about it, I haven't made a guard bolster since.

Showing the blade-centering issue- Top picture below is my "Rite Edge" switchblade, the bottom pic is the second one I built.

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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by tr4252 »

sammy the blade wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 8:21 pm Tom, I remember when you were doing those. I would have gave a testicle for one of them, maybe both of them.
Thanks Sammy, those were fun times.

Tom
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tr4252
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by tr4252 »

Thanks for the compliments Killgar, the feeling is mutual.

Blades always drove me nuts. I couldn't be satisfied with them until I was making my own, and it was a major effort. I'm a (recently retired) machinist/designer/troubleshooter by trade, and ended up buying a CNC mill for the knife projects. Best move I could have made. That was 16 years ago and it's enhanced most of my other projects since.

Ultimately I realized that I probably couldn't afford to produce switchblades commercially because of liability issues and the patchwork of regulations I'd be getting involved in.

Throughout the years here at Talkblade, the membership has always been very encouraging and helpful. I had as much fun interacting with the guys here as I did building knives. Welcome aboard.

Tom
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Killgar
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by Killgar »

tr4252 wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 3:50 am Thanks for the compliments Killgar, the feeling is mutual.

Blades always drove me nuts. I couldn't be satisfied with them until I was making my own, and it was a major effort. I'm a (recently retired) machinist/designer/troubleshooter by trade, and ended up buying a CNC mill for the knife projects. Best move I could have made. That was 16 years ago and it's enhanced most of my other projects since.

Ultimately I realized that I probably couldn't afford to produce switchblades commercially because of liability issues and the patchwork of regulations I'd be getting involved in.

Throughout the years here at Talkblade, the membership has always been very encouraging and helpful. I had as much fun interacting with the guys here as I did building knives. Welcome aboard.

Tom
Thank you for the welcome Tom, I'm happy to be here among likeminded people.

I can only wonder what I would do with some high-tech tools. I do all of my work with a 20 year old benchtop drill press, a 12" Harbor Freight disc sander, a 20 year old Dremel, a 40 year old hacksaw, a tiny work bench with a vise, and a wide assortment of files. And that's it. Is it any wonder I dislike making stiletto guard bolsters, I have to cut them out with a hacksaw, and do most of the final shaping with files.

But I get along all right. And my shop (a little space in my tiny one car garage) wouldn't accommodate any big tools.

I've been reading this forum since 2015, when I first started working on switchblades. I should have joined up sooner. Better late than never. :D

And just for the hell of it, here are some pics of my bolsters and lock release mechanism. I call it a "slide release". I cut a groove across the back of the bolster, and a 1/16" thick stainless steel tab slides back and forth across the groove between the bolster and the liner, the pivot holds the tab/slide in place. When the front of the slide is pressed, the back end of it pushes the lock away from the blade-

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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by tr4252 »

That lock mechanism looks interesting Killgar, you invent this?

What you've accomplished with your limited shop, as you describe it, is a testimony to your skill. I started the same way, and can appreciate what you have done with basic tools. My own shop has grown over the years to where it takes up about half my basememt. 2 CNC machines (one which I built), a small manual 3 axis mill, manual lathe, a coupleof band saws, new drill press (I wrecked the old one trying to use it as a milling machine), a welding rig, router table, jigs and fixtures too numerous to mention, etc... the list seems endless, and the majority of it to make knives. I guess I was pretty obsessed with it for a while there. Files, don't get me started, I have a few (hundred).

Then I met a woman who seems to think that living in a house converted into a knife factory wasn't really comfortable. (Odd, the last girlfriend didn't mind the graphic arts business that used to fill the house) That, plus the liability issue convinced me to look for more benign things to make, now that I had such a handy shop. Since then it's been model airplane parts, musical instrument parts and accessories, etc. I've enjoyed the work no matter what I'm building, and I think subconsiously I am doing what I've done throughout my career to hang on to my glory days a bit.

I wish I could share my little factory with you, it'd be interesting to see what you would come up with.

Tom
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Killgar
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by Killgar »

tr4252 wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:14 pm That lock mechanism looks interesting Killgar, you invent this?

What you've accomplished with your limited shop, as you describe it, is a testimony to your skill. I started the same way, and can appreciate what you have done with basic tools. My own shop has grown over the years to where it takes up about half my basememt. 2 CNC machines (one which I built), a small manual 3 axis mill, manual lathe, a coupleof band saws, new drill press (I wrecked the old one trying to use it as a milling machine), a welding rig, router table, jigs and fixtures too numerous to mention, etc... the list seems endless, and the majority of it to make knives. I guess I was pretty obsessed with it for a while there. Files, don't get me started, I have a few (hundred).

Then I met a woman who seems to think that living in a house converted into a knife factory wasn't really comfortable. (Odd, the last girlfriend didn't mind the graphic arts business that used to fill the house) That, plus the liability issue convinced me to look for more benign things to make, now that I had such a handy shop. Since then it's been model airplane parts, musical instrument parts and accessories, etc. I've enjoyed the work no matter what I'm building, and I think subconsiously I am doing what I've done throughout my career to hang on to my glory days a bit.

I wish I could share my little factory with you, it'd be interesting to see what you would come up with.

Tom
I appreciate the kind words Tom. And it sounds like you've got a great shop.

As for my "slide release", although I conceived of the idea out of my imagination, I don't know if I can claim that I invented it. I assume that someone else, at some time, had also come up with the idea. I've never seen it before, and I've searched, but I've never found another example, nor has anyone ever been able to point one out to me.

I've never been a fan of the swivel bolster, and the heads on the locks that I used were too small for pick locks. So on the "Rite Edge" auto I made a wrap-around thumb-press that I bolted directly to the lock (pics below). It works great, but it lacks "subtlety" and "refinement".

For my second 11" stiletto I was going all-out. So I wracked my brain for a lock release mechanism that was easy to operate, but subtle and refined in both appearance and function, and the "slide release" is what I came up with. I've only used it one other time, on a 9" Classic Frank Beltrame that I rebuilt (pics below). Filing the slot for the slide by hand, especially in steel is a piece of work.

For me, building switchblades is a "hot or cold" type of thing. In 2015-2016 I was doing them pretty much one after the other (the two 11" stilettos are from 2016), then I went cold and did nothing from the end of 2016 to the Fall of 2021, and I actually thought I was all done building switchblades. Then last year I got the itch again, and that led me to attempt my first Cold Steel Ti-Lite 6 conversion, which had been a dream of mine for several years. Since that success I've been running hot again. I actually just came in from my "shop" where I was working on my latest project.

When you mentioned "girlfriend" it reminded me of the woman I was with back in 2016. I'd spend hours trying to get a switchblade action dialed-in: no blade play, but with a strong opening. Taking it apart, making an adjustment, re-assembling, test, then taking it apart, making an adjustment, etc, etc, over and over again, for 2 hours, and I'd get frustrated, and be cursing, then I'd take a break, walk out into the living room and sit next to her on the couch exhausted, and she'd say- "I thought hobbies were supposed to be relaxing".

Fortunately for me now the knives I work on are a lot easier (Ti-Lite's), and that's just one of the many reasons why I like them, and why my passion for switchblades has been reignited.

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One of my Frank Beltrames. Aluminum handles, flat button, stainless steel cover plate.


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Last edited by Killgar on Sat Jun 25, 2022 9:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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tr4252
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by tr4252 »

You're doing some super work Killgore. It's great to see someone with such similar interests. You'll be a terriffic addition to the forum and I look forward to future discussions.

Meanwhile, we should probably give Mr. Cop_Out's thread back before we commit a thread hijacking.

Tom
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Killgar
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Re: Newbie Question - Italian Stilettos

Post by Killgar »

tr4252 wrote: Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:16 am You're doing some super work Killgore. It's great to see someone with such similar interests. You'll be a terriffic addition to the forum and I look forward to future discussions.

Meanwhile, we should probably give Mr. Cop_Out's thread back before we commit a thread hijacking.

Tom
It's been good talking with you Tom. I'll see you around the forum :) .
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